Reporter: Israel is facing many serious security problems with Syria, Lebanon, Iran and the PLO. Tell us how you would negotiate with Syria, for example.
Maccabean: The first thing I would do is stop talking about the Golan as primarily a security
issue. I would repeat often that it is Israeli territory with a long Jewish history, which also
happens to be vital for Israeli security and water supplies.
Reporter: The Syrians are demanding that you agree to withdraw from the Golan before peace talks can begin.
Maccabean: It is true that this is a Syrian demand. I would present the following Israeli demands:
1. Syria must relinquish all claims of sovereignty on the Golan as compensation for the pain, suffering and loss of life they caused Israel during their occupation of it.
2. Since peace agreements with non-democratic countries are useless, we would insist on full democratization in Syria before beginning negotiations. This would naturally include full civil and human rights for its citizens, including minorities.
3. We would certainly insist on Syria breaking ties with terrorist organizations like Hizbullah and terrorist states like Iran, Lybia, Iraq, and the Sudan.
4. Syria would have to withdraw its occupation troops from Lebanon and allow a true representative government to develop there.
5. An finally we would demand that Syria stop producing and selling drugs and counterfeit money
on the world markets.
Reporter: Those are very tough demands. How can you ever make peace with Syria if those are your pre-conditions?
Maccabean: These are the pre-conditions that make peace with Syria possible. Anything less is
Reporter: Lebanon is intimately connected to the question of Syria. How would you resolve the seemingly endless Israeli losses in that troubled country.
Maccabean: The biggest problem for Israel in Lebanon is its self-inflicted restriction on the use
of military power. Israel is like a giant fighting pygmies and then deciding to tie one hand behind
its back and wear a blindfold on one eye and perhaps even hobbling one leg. There is one essential
principle of military success and that is to use overwhelming force at a speed that keeps the enemy
off balance and vulnerable. The defensive limited war being fought by the IDF in Lebanon is a
recipe for failure. It plays in to the hands of the enemy by fighting the type of war they are best
prepared to face. The United Nations and United States connections serve only to limit Israel's
freedom of action.
Reporter: How would you fight this war in Lebanon?
Maccabean: The first thing I would do is reverse the political losses Israel suffered since Operation Accountability and the Grapes of Wraith.
1. This would be done by a continuous massive artillery and ariel bombardment on all areas associated with the Hizbullah. Ignore all international repercussions, vigorously proclaiming the right of self-defense. All monitoring organizations should be ignored and renounced.
2. Syrian bases in Lebanon that have supplied the terrorists should be destroyed.
3. Israeli troops should clear the area up to the Litani of all hostile forces.
4. While not extending the security zone permanently, Israel should announce that the whole of southern Lebanon from the Litani to the Israeli border is an area of operations and a free fire zone. Israel should further declare that no normal life will take place until the Hizbullah are disarmed and expelled.
5. Syrian economic interests in Lebanon will be destroyed including the drug producing areas of the Bekka Valley.
6. It should be made clear that new rules apply to Lebanon. Rather, all parties should know that
there are NO RULES that limit Israeli action there. Lebanon is a jungle. Let Israeli soldiers march
into that jungle exclaiming: "Yea though I walk through the Valley of the Shadow of Death, I
will fear no evil, because the L-rd is with me and anyway I am the meanest SOB in the
Reporter: It sounds like you are against the traditional policy of "restraint" in the IDF.
Maccabean: That policy may have been important in the past, but today we face a barbarian
enemy who sees our restraint as weakness, making him more aggressive. He must be disabused of
Reporter: What do you think of Netanyahu's handling of the Palestinian negotiations properly?
Maccabean: Let me make one thing perfectly clear: Oslo is a death sentence for Israel. To ask if
Bibi is handling the negotiations with the Palestinians properly is to engage in an oxymoronic
fantasy. There are no 'good' negotiations with Arafat. The PLO makes no secret of its intention
to replace Israel from "the river to the sea." To negotiate is to play their game. And it is a zero-sum game: what they gain for Palestine is subtracted from Israel.
Reporter: But aren't you ignoring the political reality on the ground. Can you really turn the Oslo clock back.
Maccabean: History is full of territorial and political reversals. Just look at Europe during the
last 150 years. For Israel to survive, Oslo must go. This will mean a war with the Palestinians and
maybe some Arab countries. It is the price of survival. Freedom is won with the blood of patriots
but must be preserved with the blood of our children. It is an illusion to believe that we can
survive in this hostile region without fighting cruel wars. Appeasement only makes those
inevitable wars more difficult to win. Even in Biblical times, the Israelites faced constant conflict.
Reporter: What about the reactions, indeed the outrage, from America and Europe?
Maccabean: We will have to accept some economic discomfort and political isolation. But this is
the price of freedom of action to preserve our country. Our consular officials will need to earn
their pay explaining our positions to the world. Looked at logically it should not be that hard.
After all the previous Labor government made an agreement with a mass murderer, who planed to
destroy us, and now we have come to our senses. There is a large reservoir of good will for Israel
in America. Millions of Christians and Jews are fundamentally on our side. Properly guided they
can ease the damage from our new policy.
Reporter: Jerusalem has been in the news lately with regards to new Jewish housing at Har Homa. The Americans has expressed dissatisfaction with not only housing but new roads around the city. What do you think?
Maccabean: First let the Israeli government complain to the US about the highways near Washington and housing projects there, etc. Let the Americans realize how ridiculous this sounds. The Israeli government needs to rid itself of the idea that America should either be consulted or give its approval for any Israeli action. Enough is enough! American diplomats like Dennis Ross and Martin Indyk should be politely informed that their help in making decisions is no longer desired. My plan for Jerusalem:
1. Rapid building in all sectors of the city to increase not only the numbers of Jews but the prosperity of the city.
2. Close all PLO offices in the city (as opposed to just saying that you are going to do that).
3. Remove the Moslem Waqf from control of the Temple Mount and encourage Jewish worship there in areas not forbidden by the Torah. Remove all evidence of Palestinian control on the Temple Mount.
4. Complete all roads necessary to connect Jerusalem to all areas of the country.
5. Annex Bethlehem and all territory as far east as Maale Adumin to a greater Jerusalem.
6. Evict all PA police and security personnel from Jerusalem.
7. Take over all educational institutions and introduce positive pro-Israel, Zionist courses in the
curricula of all schools including Arab ones.
Reporter: Before we close, let me ask you about the growing threat of chemical, biological and nuclear weapons from Syria, Iran, and Iraq. How would you deal with this threat?
Maccabean: Pre-emption, pre-emption, and pre-emption. Anything else is a foolhardy gamble
with Israeli lives.
Reporter: Has terrorism become an existential threat to Israel and how should we deal with it.
Maccabean: Contrary to what many experts believe, Terrorism has, in fact, become an existential
threat to Israeli survival. This is for two importance reasons. First, it exposes Israel's rapidly
declining level of deterrence vis a vis the Arabs. This leads to an increased frequency and
seriousness of attacks. Secondly, the repeated assaults on the Israeli people have a deleterious
effect on the health of the nation. This process is much like a living organism that is attacked
repeatedly by infection, suffers a failure of its immune system and dies. The Chinese call it the
"death of a thousand cuts." No single terrorist attack will bring down the State of Israel, but
repeated attacks weaken morale and the will to fight. Oslo is the perfect example of the policies
of a nation that has lost the will to fight, to survive.
Reporter: How did this terrorist threat develop?
Maccabean: Terrorism derives among other things from the decline in Israeli deterrence.
Unfortunately Israelis are daily witnessing the consequences of ten years of declining deterrence
vis a vis its Arab population. In 1987, the intifada presented Israel with a new challenge. It was a
new kind of war, but with the same aim of driving the Israelis out of their country. The Israelis
fought the intifada with many handicaps, not the least of which were their own rules of conduct.
Israeli soldiers failed to cope with attacks by teenage Arab boys. In the course of several years,
the Arabs learned that the soldiers would not aggressively retaliate for their attacks. They became
The Jews living in Judea, Samaria, and Gaza showed great fortitude, enduring thousands of
attacks and still tripling their numbers. The serious security failure developed as Arabs became
accustomed to attacking Jews and Israeli soldiers. By trying to remain humane in the face of
massive attacks, Israel emboldened the Arabs to more and more attacks. Throwing concrete
boulders, Molotov cocktails, and then using firearms at Israelis became the norm of behavior
among the Arabs. The Israeli government allowed its citizens to be attacked solely because they
were Jews. In no other country of the world would such a policy be tolerated.
In 1991, the Persian Gulf War, with its SCUD attacks on Israel, further undermined Israeli
deterrence. Having to depend on United States Forces instead of her own had a deleterious effect
on Israeli self-confidence. It is notable that the Arab population of Judea and Samaria danced on
their on their roofs and cried, "Gas the Jews" as the SCUD's headed for Tel Aviv. The self-assurance of the Israelis also declined immensely as a result of their cowering in sealed rooms
during the missile attacks.
Israel, with its powerful military and independent citizens, had always been an affront to Moslems
everywhere. Therefore, Jews should be made subservient, weak and dependent on the approval of
their Moslem overlords. Peres understood that Israel in its present borders was too strong to be
destroyed. He also understood that the Arabs were offended that they could not destroy Israel
within its defensible borders. The Peres solution seems to involve making Israel weak, creating a
PLO state, and generally groveling before Arab rulers. Such an emasculated dhimmis-like Israel,
would now win the approval of the Islamic world. Labor, the US and Europe would call it
"peace." Some would call it appeasement. Some would cheer. Some would protest. Freeman
Center members (and real Zionists) see the Peres/PLO (and now Netanyahu) plan as a nightmare
and pray that Israel's leaders will come to their senses and return to a policy of deterrence,
security and defense of Israeli interests.
Reporter: But how would you stop terrorism?
Maccabean: Terrorism is not an act of nature like an earthquake. It can be fought and controlled
if there is the political will to do so. The key is the political will to fight a tough and dirty battle.
Netanyahu doesn't have that will today, but Israeli leaders in the past have shown us how it can
Terrorist groups like Hamas or Islamic Jihad operate within a community of supporters who
supply them with weapons, safe houses, intelligence, and new recruits for their units. The first
step in counteracting a terrorist movement is to infiltrate its organizational structure. For this you
need members of the community willing to help you for money, protection or even conviction.
Israel's General Security Services (GSS) successfully infiltrated the major terrorist organizations
in the past. This has always been the quintesessential prerequisite to successful military operations
against those terrorists.
When Israel signed the Oslo agreement with the PLO in September of 1993, it agreed to share
intelligence with them and to cooperate with them in the preservation of security for both Jews
and Arabs. In the course of that intelligence sharing, Israel revealed to the PLO the names of
Arabs in Judea, Samaria, and Gaza who had aided them in their battle against terrorism. The PLO
then directed its police and security forces to murder all of these Arabs as "collaborators with
the enemy." Thus, the eyes and ears of Israeli intelligence were destroyed.
The PLO deal signed at Oslo also called for the extradition of Arabs guilty of crimes in Israel to
be returned to Israel for trial. The PLO was to crack down on all terrorist groups within the area
of its jurisdiction (Gaza and Jericho). The Oslo script was not followed. PLO controlled areas
became "safe havens" for terrorist groups to organize and plan their murderous operations. The
Israeli Defense Forces (IDF) were effectively banned from those areas and Hamas members could
stroll the streets of Gaza unmolested with their machine guns. The PLO police refused to perform
any police function in relation to terrorists, devoting themselves to civil problems like robbery and
It is now a three and half years since Oslo and the terrorist groups have grown and prospered in
the friendly atmosphere created by the Rabin/Peres/Netanyahu government's pursuit of "peace."
It is true that a dedicated suicide bomber is extremely difficult to stop. This is the very reason that
a proper security approach requires destroying the environment in which suicide bombers are
There are no magic solutions, but here is what needs to be done to restore security to the
1. The Oslo PLO/Israel deal must be canceled.
2. The IDF will have to destroy all terrorist bases in the PA areas. Heavy artillery and air strikes should be used to devastate and paralyze the population. An escape route into Sinai should be opened for refugees.
3. A new network of Israeli agents will have to be built up (this takes time),
4. All Hamas social institutions should be destroyed.
5. The use of explosive sniffing dogs should be authorized
6. The borders of Gaza should be closed with no Arab workers crossing into Israel. This should be permanent. It should cause great economic hardship in Gaza and lead eventually to the emigration of Arabs from there.
7. Issue the following new security rule: Soldiers and Jewish civilians are allowed to shoot to kill anyone attacking them (including attacks with any object larger than a grain of sand). No qualifications, no prosecutions.
8. All terrorists guilty of murder or attempt to murder should be executed with their bodies cremated to prevent their graves from becoming sites of veneration. Executions should be performed quickly to prevent international outcry and terrorist attempts to free the condemned.
9. All Arab prisoners that were released early should be re-arrested and jailed or given the choice
of leaving Israel for good.
These are tough actions, but they will work. There is no way to fight terrorism with "kid gloves."
If you are not willing to get "down and dirty" with them, they will win. The terrorist has no guilt
like some Jews. His motivation is clear and in the case of the suicide bomber, (he believes)
paradise awaits him.
Reporter: And finally, how would you rate the new Likud Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu.
Maccabean: He has been more than a great disappointment to the security-minded Israeli voter.
The majority voted for him in an effort to rid Israel of the disaster of Oslo inflicted by the
previous Labor government. Many from the Religious/Zionist sector of the population voted for
him with the fond hope of restoring Jewish pride and Jewish values to the country. Both of these
groups have been traumatized by Bibi's reversal of positions on everything important to them,
from Hebron to Jerusalem. It is as if Bibi was a "Manchurian Candidate," secretly programed
for a different (leftist) agenda following election. His actions have revealed a contempt for the
voters who put him in office. But worse still, those actions reveal that his security concepts similar
to the self-destructive Labor/Meretz/Arab alliance that brought us the catastrophe of Oslo. Just as
Labor was brought down by the National Camp, Bibi will have to be replaced by someone true to
the principles of Zionism, security, Judaism, and Eretz Yisrael.
We should all pray that HaShem will deliver us from the false leaders that afflict us.
Reporter: Thank you for taking the time for this important interview.